1. Welcome,
    SXSNation is a UTV Community that brings enthusiasts together regardless of brand, a place to find local rides, partake in discussion, buy or sell within a marketplace, or just rant about anything side by sides. Interact directly with top Vendors in the Industry, find exclusive discounts and specials and participate in weekly giveaways! If you haven't registered yet, what are you waiting for?
    Dismiss Notice

The Official Polaris 700/800 Oil Pressure Relief Valve Thread

Discussion in 'Full Size: 700, 800, 2009-2014 Model Years' started by DieselFume, Feb 24, 2017.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 1)

  1. Fxr
  1. Yamadoopolcat

    Yamadoopolcat Lee SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2016
    Posts:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Prince George
    Side X Side(s):

    2014 800 Ranger full size

    Still working on this high low pressure issue.
    Today I changed oil and put on a new Polaris oil filter - started the Ranger, but still had 100 psi oil pressure as soon as I touch the gas pedal.
    I removed the spring and the dowl in the oil regulator passage - started the engine, and still had high oil pressure. The gauge needle fluctuates wildly, but will peg at 100 psi with a little gas pedal.
    Next, since there is nothing in the oil regulator gallery, I pulled the 15 mm plug off, and started the engine. I was expecting the engine oil would come puking out of that open hole, but not a drop of oil came out.
    I pushed a piece of wire about 3.25" down the oil regulatory gallery, but that did nothing. I started the engine with the wire stuck in the gallery and got even higher oil pressure! At idle the pressure was now 100psi and the engine barely wanted to run.
    I removed the hay wire and hooked up an airgun and blew a shot of air in the open oil regulator gallery. I started the engine and oil started coming out of the gallery - so I THOUGHT that was the solution. I installed the 15mm plug, started the engine and the pressure was the same high oil pressure.
    I repeated the air trick but I never did get any more oil out of the open oil gallery, yet the gauge is showing 100psi

    Moving on, I pulled the new oil filter off, removed the spin on thread adapter, and blew air down the open oil regulator gallery and lots of air came out the center of the oil filter flange. So no blockage, I guess?
    I put the adapter back on, spun the oil filter on, started the engine and the oil pressure is still hitting 100psi and no oil is coming out the open oil regulator gallery.

    Anyone that has had these engines apart have any idea how there can be oil pressure with an open oil regulator gallery? And how is it that there is no oil coming out of the oil gallery with no 15mm plug in the hole?
     
  2. Yamadoopolcat

    Yamadoopolcat Lee SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2016
    Posts:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Prince George
    Side X Side(s):

    2014 800 Ranger full size

    Grrrrrrrrrrrrrr...
    The oil pressure gauge was sitting at 100psi with the engine off. When I started the engine one more time, the indicator didn't move off 100psi, so obviously another problem. Also I could tell by the valve noise that there could be no oil pressure.
    Looking around I found that the slip on connector to the oil pressure sender had become disconnected. Grrrrrrr!!
    I pushed the connector back in place, and started the engine. The oil pressure gauge indicated 0 psi. This is what I expect to be normal considering there was no 15mm plug or parts in the oil gallery.
    I installed the spring, dowl and the 15mm plug. Started the engine and the gauge showed 75 psi with 0w40 full synthetic and new Polaris filter and engine temperature 90F.
    At 205F the pressure was 25 psi at idle and 50 psi at 4,500 rpm.
    Oil pressure is completely normal, but since when?
    I have to try another road test this weekend to see if the oil consumption is still severely high, and in the past the engine oil filter has blown out from high pressure, so not very confident anything has changed.
    Grrrr...
     
  3. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!

    Hi Lee-

    Now that you know your oil ports are not blocked, I'd suggest two things. 1st, I think you should go to a Small Block Chevy head dowel that is available from Summit Racing or Jegs for just a few bucks. Put it in place of the original dowell, and ditch the 2 ball bearing setup. I ran the chevy head stud dowel for several hundred hours on my rangers with no issues at all (and no stuck relief valves or blow out oil filters) and managed to keep 32 psi hot, and about 10-20 at idle (hot) which is plenty for the 800 to live on.

    2nd thing I'd do is get to the bottom of your oil consumption issue. If it's not leaking it, it's mostly likely burning it. I'd be willing to bet that as many times as it's been run low on oil that your cylinder bores and pistons are completely scored. Going to cost about minimum of around $750 in parts to fix if you do the work yourself.

    Dumping in $10-20 of oil in each day gets expensive and it's not good for the engine to burn that much oil.
     
  4. Fxr

    Fxr Bubba SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2017
    Posts:
    4
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    WI
    Side X Side(s):

    2010 Ranger 800 XP

    First off thanks to all you guys for posting this info.

    I have rebuilt everything from a briggs to V-8 big blocks and tractors, so didnt think this one would be too bad to take on. I picked up a used 800 XP, motor was in pieces in a box, for what I thought was an alright deal.

    Busted rod, cam in 4 pcs, trashed monoblock and some beat up valves. After assessing the damages and looking the machine over more when I got home my great deal and cheap rebuild ideas were not quite so great but still not bad. Anyway got all parts, cleaned up what was still usable which was basically the cases and head. Rebuilt the motor bottom end (including the oil pump) and went through the head. While cleaning the cases I pulled out the stock Oil pressure relief dowel and spring (dowel was stuck good) cleaned up the bore a little to what I thought was decent and put in a new stock dowel and spring. All of this without knowing or reading about the problems with this oil regulator setup.

    Motor all back together and mounted in machine. Primed through Oil port as manual directed and turned over with starter with spark plugs out to check oil pressure as I normally do with a rebuilt engine to make sure I have at least something. But nothing on this one. Talked to a Polaris dealer they said I may not see oil pressure just turning it over like that so I connected everything up and fired it up. Popped off great on second crank (which I was surprised enough at) but no oil pressure, ran 10 sec, and I shut it down. After much pondering, and a drink or two, I said wth so I fired it back up and gave it some gas, oil pressure came up after about 10-15 seconds, as much as I hated running a fresh motor with no load at 2500-3000 rpm I kept it at that for a bit as it did have some oil pressure and wanted to see if it would get better, if there was some air in the system or the pump was not fully primed. It didnt get any better. After letting it drop back to an idle there was no oil pressure again with a warm but not hot engine.

    I was running some 5w-50 Syn with break in additive. With more pondering, and just to test, I decided to up the oil to some 20w-50 I had laying around for the Harley to see if I could just get some better pressure at idle to do some more trouble shooting. Cant even get it to prime or put out any pressure now.

    - - - - - That is when I came looking and found this forum.

    First, my plan is to pull the engine back out as I am a big boy with big hands and I cant really get in there by the regulator parts worth a crap with engine installed. I was able to once and removed the plug and spring only to find that the dowel was stuck and I could not get it out with a magnet. Obviously with no pressure I cant force the dowel out by starting it. So I will pull the engine. I have a plan of building a plate that screws on where the filter goes and using shop air to back feed the pressure side of the pump and regulator and hopefully pop out the dowel without pulling the engine back apart.

    That said, I want to make sure it is a dowel stuck up off the seat (not sealing) kind of problem and not something else.

    So.... In post #5 there are some helpful dimensions, in post #8 there is a picture attached which could possibly fill in the missing info but I can't see it so I am not sure. I am looking for the dimension from the top of the boss on the case where the plug screws in, down to the top of the fully seated stock dowel. Or from the top of the boss down to the actual seat where the dowel is suppose to seat. From this I can at least tell before removal if the dowel (in its current state) is stuck up off the seat causing my issues and proceed with cleaning, honing and either the head alignment dowel as mentioned earlier or machining one.

    As there is one other possible cause and that is where the two case halves come together to form the Oil pump suction tube/port. It is possibly sucking air there.

    Another on the side question would be has anybody tested oil pressure just by turning the motor with the starter but not starting?

    Thanks in advance and sorry for the long winded first post. But I always say you can never have enough information. Especially if someone reads this later and it helps them or saves them some trouble shooting time.
     
    Rockin Ronnie likes this.
  5. Rockin Ronnie

    Rockin Ronnie Ron Team SXS Nation

    Joined:
    May 20, 2017
    Posts:
    197
    Likes Received:
    118
    Location:
    Michigan
    Side X Side(s):

    Polaris General
    Polaris Ranger

    welcome to the nation Fxr! will be watching to see what you find
     
  6. Yamadoopolcat

    Yamadoopolcat Lee SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2016
    Posts:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Prince George
    Side X Side(s):

    2014 800 Ranger full size

     

    Attached Files:

  7. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!

    Left piston skirt looks to be scored? How's the bore look?

    Lots of glare on the piston pic, what are you seeing? or can you take another pic of the skirts? and one of the bore? You definitely have an issue on the left hand cylinder!
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2017
  8. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!

    Hi Bubba and welcome to The Nation!

    I hope I can help you with your problem.

    You are correct about the stuck valve causing alot of 700/800 engines to meet an early demise. At least you caught yours right away and didn't take off rodding it thinking there was no issue there.

    I have never had to split a 700/800 engine, so you are farther ahead than I am in terms of knowing what's inside the case. I have had some issues with valves being stuck but always was able to get them out with a magnet or with engine oil pressure. Another thing that works really well is using some very slick oil such as synthetic Lucas oil additive and then trying to remove the dowel. Think I would maybe even try a small amount of heat to the underside of the bore before I resorted to pulling the engine and breaking it down. Have you tried pushing down on the dowel with a seal pick or short screwdriver to see if you could get it to free up? If you are getting zero oil pressure than I can only assume your valve is suck open and you should be able to push it back down and maybe get it freed up with some lubricant...

    As for dimensions, I don't have that information off hand but if you give me a day or two I might be able to find time to pull the plug on my last remaining 800 and check the distance from the top of the dowel to the top of the bore for you...

    If you do get it out, whatever you do don't put it back in. Use a dowel for a small block chevy cylinder head instead. it's about .010 " smaller in diameter and length, and will work just fine in place of the stock unit...
     
  9. Yamadoopolcat

    Yamadoopolcat Lee SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2016
    Posts:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Prince George
    Side X Side(s):

    2014 800 Ranger full size

    I only have the one picture, taken about a year ago (about 50 hrs). They look bad in the picture, but didn't look bad at the time. I'm used to 2 stroke engines that are bad, and this 800 Ranger 4 stroke looked good.
    But ...... starting over, might as well go there first. At least the rings should still be good.
     
  10. Fxr

    Fxr Bubba SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2017
    Posts:
    4
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    WI
    Side X Side(s):

    2010 Ranger 800 XP

    Thanks Adam,

    I agree the stock dowel will not be going back in. It will be a chevy head dowel or the like. I was thinking of making one and have it just a little longer for more preload. But that can always be tested later after the removal and cleanup of the current issue.

    I would certainly appreciate it if you could get that measurement for me as none of my friends run this vintage and size of machine, or I would have one of them bring theirs over and I would tare into it and check myself.

    I am pretty sure one way or another I can get the old one out without taring it back down but really want to know the current status/position of the dowel to feel comfortable about its replacement solving the problem and not that something else is causing issues or is part of the issue.

    As a little side note humor, this thing had sat for a while ripped apart. Unknown to me the stupid mice had made a home in muffler/spark arrestor, when I first fired it up boy was it quiet and ran a little rough, exhaust manifold got red hot real quick. As I looked back it shot mouse house pieces all over my garage. Muffler is still half plugged as I think some of the foam and fluffy stuff they used is melted in there now. Had to get a new one.

    Also bad ujoints on the front drive shaft sounds surprisingly like marbles in the motor. The motor vibrations caused the front drive shaft to rattle and make a horrible noise that changed pitch with the engine rpm causing me to think for a moment that there was something very very wrong inside the fresh engine right of the bat.
     
    DieselFume likes this.
  11. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!

    lol, yeah the mice get into everything around here too!

    Those driveshaft U joints are an ongoing deal with the polaris. You can replace them with a Napa P338 that's greaseable that should give you better service life. will try and get measurements today.
     
  12. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!


    I'd say do a compression test on the cylinders, but I've seen them scored and still test good, so I don't know how much good that would do. How was the intake valve seal in that picture you took? I replaced mine after an engine dusting and rebuild awhile back, and it took care of a bad oil consumption problem I was having. Might replace those seals first before tearing down if you suspect the skirts are ok? Just hard to tell from those pictures.

    You could also rent/buy a bore scope and look through the spark plug hole at the cyl walls to see what they look like before tearing down. I think you can even get them from harbor freight now for stupid cheap price.
     
  13. Yamadoopolcat

    Yamadoopolcat Lee SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2016
    Posts:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Prince George
    Side X Side(s):

    2014 800 Ranger full size

    Just thinking back about this engine, and when I took the cylinder down to the machine shop, they tried to hatch pattern the cylinder bores. I never thought much at the time, but I bet the Nikasil is toast and that is likely the issue with this engine.
    I'm ordering a top end kit off Ebay Powersportsparts for $700 Canadian shipped.
     
  14. Fxr

    Fxr Bubba SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2017
    Posts:
    4
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    WI
    Side X Side(s):

    2010 Ranger 800 XP

    Adam hate to bug u again but if you have an oil presure gauge on your 800 could you pull the plug wires and see if you get any pressure while cranking? If you dont no big deal. Im just looking to see if i can bench test pressure while I have the engine out.
     
  15. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!


    Bubba, I was able to pull the plug today and measure the depth from the top of the dowel to the top of the bore with the spring removed. It is right at 1.5" as best as I could tell.

    I'll see what I can do on the oil pressure, I'm thinking on a cold engine a person would see some oil pressure, but not sure.
     
  16. Fxr

    Fxr Bubba SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2017
    Posts:
    4
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    WI
    Side X Side(s):

    2010 Ranger 800 XP

    Thanks Adam, that is exactly what i needed. I really appreciate you taking the time to check that for me.

    Got the engine out and on the bench in an hr. And then after seeing your response with that dimension i was able to see where my issue was. And yes the dowel was stuck up in the bore, about a half inch high. Which means the pressure side of the pump was dumping right back into the suction.

    Anyway i dicked around for another 45 min trying to get the dowel out and realized i had just wasted more time then it would have taken to just pull it apart and do it right. So in another half hour i had it all apart and oil pump out staring at the dowel which was barely even sticking out into the suction port.

    With a twist of a 90 degree pick it was loose.

    Cleaned up the bore (and then some) with some 600 grit wet paper, oil and a 1/4" wood dowel. Thus the reason it was better to pull it apart as i could flush the ports with cleaner after the hone. Stock dowel slides up and down like a champ now. I will be taking some measurements of the bore tomorrow to see what kind of clearances i have after honing. And decide what to do about a dowel.

    The other reason for pulling it apart was to give you and others that have not cracked one of these open some pics of what it looks like in there.

    I will get back and post pics and probably some other nonsense once its back together and running with oil pressure. Just hoping i did not do any major bearing or cam damage while i was playing with it the first round.
     
    Rockin Ronnie likes this.
  17. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!

    You're welcome for the information. Glad to help,

    Happy to hear you're on the road to getting the issue resolved!

    Sounds like a job, but a worthwhile one.

    Yes, that would be great if you'll post up some pics of what you ran into and how you resolved the situation!

    Best of luck,

    Adam
     
  18. TfetIII

    TfetIII Tom SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2017
    Posts:
    2
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Arkansas
    Side X Side(s):

    2011 Ranger 800 Crew

    Greetings all...new to this forum and have a 2011 800 Crew. I am trying to figure out the best way to remove the oil pressure relief valve. It looks to me like the motor mount bracket needs to come out so you can get in there to remove the bolt to access it. Does that sound right?

    Thanks!

    Tom
     
  19. DieselFume

    DieselFume Adam Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2016
    Posts:
    1,395
    Likes Received:
    1,046
    Location:
    Montana
    Side X Side(s):

    2013 XP 800 Ranger, 3 2017 Polaris 570 Full Sizes. All doomed for hard ranch work, long hours and rough conditions. 5 years or bust!

    Hi Tom-

    Here's a video I made awhile back about how I accessed my oil press relief valve on my 800-


    I went in through the side, but it's a one armed blind job, and might be too difficult for many.

    The book way of accessing it is to remove the front panel from in front of the engine and below the seat, unbolting the ecu, and then you can remove the exhaust piping/ Y pipe. Then you can access the plug for the relief valve. You don't need to remove the support for the front of the engine to access it, but if you want to be able to see the plug and access it easier than you do have to remove it. which is not exactly easy either. If it were me, I'd try it first with the engine support in place. You will most likely need a pen magnet- I used a broken off one to retrieve the spring and dowel out of the bore. a full length pen magnet is probably too long unless you move the support brace.

    If the dowel is stuck you might have to crank and start the engine briefly to use engine oil pressure to push the dowel out. Just be sure you have rags in the area to catch it!

    I would recommend replacing the dowel with a small block chevy head stud dowel available from Summit Racing, or Jegs. Look a little further up this thread and you'll find many references to it!

    holler if you need more help!

    Adam
     
  20. TfetIII

    TfetIII Tom SXS Nation Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2017
    Posts:
    2
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Arkansas
    Side X Side(s):

    2011 Ranger 800 Crew

    Thanks Adam. After doing a little more looking, I have decided to try to remove it without removing the bracket and any other panels. Also going to look into the SBC dowel at Summit and ordering one of those.

    Tom
     
    DieselFume likes this.

Share This Page